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Ogata Haruna to graduate MM&H!P 67 replies to this topic Started by AquaChan , Mar 27 2018 01:44 PM · 

#31 yuzu

yuzu
  • FRUIT UNITY

Posted 28 March 2018 - 05:41 PM

This is the first time I've ever been happy about a grad announcement I'm a terrible person lol. It is surprising though, but yeah this'll be good for her because the idol world was just clearly not for her.

 

I cheered and celebrated with bubbly when Reina's grad was announced.



#32 Mizura

Mizura
  • ANGERME

Posted 29 March 2018 - 06:16 AM

This is the first time I've ever been happy about a grad announcement I'm a terrible person lol. It is surprising though, but yeah this'll be good for her because the idol world was just clearly not for her.


I cheered and celebrated with bubbly when Reina's grad was announced.

I’ve actually been fairly okay with most announced graduations. It’s usually the unannounced ones That are beyond the girls control that make me sad (such as Uta, AiAi, etc).

#33 Madara

Madara
  • ANGERME

Posted 12 April 2018 - 12:04 AM

I caused a firestorm on Facebook for suggesting that if this is the worst news we get from H!P this season, then we're already much better off than we were last year by this time, given the spate of expulsions, graduations and disbandings that occurred or were announced by mid-year of 2017. It wasn't meant as a diss on Ogata, but several fans took it that way.



#34 TicTacAnyone

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  • Danbara's #1 fan

Posted 12 April 2018 - 12:25 AM

I caused a firestorm on Facebook for suggesting that if this is the worst news we get from H!P this season, then we're already much better off than we were last year by this time, given the spate of expulsions, graduations and disbandings that occurred or were announced by mid-year of 2017. It wasn't meant as a diss on Ogata, but several fans took it that way.

 

Ogata has some hardcore fans... I wouldn't take it personally. Of course it's always painful when your oshi leaves, but you should still keep it in perspective of the group/H!P. Some graduations are harder hits to the fanbase/company than others, but when it's your oshi you might forget that.



#35 Anderei

Anderei
  • つんく♂

Posted 12 April 2018 - 01:52 AM

I caused a firestorm on Facebook for suggesting that if this is the worst news we get from H!P this season, then we're already much better off than we were last year by this time, given the spate of expulsions, graduations and disbandings that occurred or were announced by mid-year of 2017. It wasn't meant as a diss on Ogata, but several fans took it that way.


Dawa is the worst news of 2018 and I’m willing to let her have 2019 too.

#36 Madara

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  • ANGERME

Posted 12 April 2018 - 04:25 AM

Yeah, it seems like I wrote that too soon because news of Dawa's decision came after the HinaFest concerts while I was in Tokyo. I'm not surprised by it but am still saddened since I see Wada as one of the prime assets of H!P right now and a superb leader of both H!P and Angerme. And I used to consider her my least favorite member of S/mileage. A lot can happen in a few years. Remember when we called her "racist-chan" here?



#37 Derby

Derby
  • モーニング娘。

Posted 17 April 2018 - 10:18 PM

You got out of it again this time, Iikubo



#38 JPope

JPope
  • Dick

Posted 19 June 2018 - 10:50 PM

Well, today's the big day in Japan. I pinned this post to the top of my blog in honor of the rich legacy Ogata is leaving behind:

 

lxuu6M3.jpg



#39 Pi Miki

Pi Miki
  • MM doll whore

Posted 20 June 2018 - 02:31 AM

^ Lol.... so basically we got the worst of the worst combined into one?  



#40 honey

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  • つばきファクトリー

Posted 20 June 2018 - 05:25 AM

Attached File  75CEA250-9788-4715-80A3-CC20C902C19C.jpeg   40.08KB   0 downloads

#41 Anderei

Anderei
  • つんく♂

Posted 20 June 2018 - 06:04 AM

^ Lol.... so basically we got the worst of the worst combined into one?


Sort of except she doesn’t stand out that badly because the entire group is below average in just about everything.

#42 Shoujo Q

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  • ( ื▿ ืʃƪ) #1 Sakura Fangirl

Posted 20 June 2018 - 09:51 AM

I’m watching this concert right now on fuijitv and they are so off it’s crazy. They aren’t usually this bad. They just destroyed Morning Coffee in the worst way possible. No one was harmonizing. Even Sakura wasn’t her usual self.

This is like Really bad guys. Every song it just gets worse.

At least they are dancing great?

#43 Meikochi

Meikochi
  • ANGERME

Posted 20 June 2018 - 10:36 AM

I'm also watching the concert on Twitch and I don't find them so bad ? I didn't see the first hour though.

Edit : besides her crack towards the end, Haachin did fine with her graduation song, to me.



#44 Shoujo Q

Shoujo Q
  • ( ื▿ ืʃƪ) #1 Sakura Fangirl

Posted 20 June 2018 - 11:47 AM

Just wait till it gets put up online somewhere. The first half was a mess. They somehow fixed it near the end. Not sure if it was a problem through the broadcast or what. They backtrack was really loud. Morning Coffee took the brunt of it all. I’m sure it will all be fixed when the concert comes out on disc though so it’ll never really be heard how bad it really was.

#45 JPope

JPope
  • Dick

Posted 20 June 2018 - 11:58 AM

I’m watching this concert right now on fuijitv and they are so off it’s crazy. They aren’t usually this bad. They just destroyed Morning Coffee in the worst way possible. No one was harmonizing. Even Sakura wasn’t her usual self.

This is like Really bad guys. Every song it just gets worse.

At least they are dancing great?

I mean, it's kind of appropriate if you think about it.



#46 Meikochi

Meikochi
  • ANGERME

Posted 20 June 2018 - 12:13 PM

I'll catch up with this twitter account first (sharing for anyone who couldn't watch it and don't want to download it).



#47 DonJuan

DonJuan
  • ANGERME

Posted 20 June 2018 - 01:44 PM

^^ I laughed.

So, yeah. Oharu looked really pretty in her graduation dress and I liked the set up of the stage.

That's it.

#48 JPope

JPope
  • Dick

Posted 20 June 2018 - 04:38 PM

I threw a post up at the blog about what Ogata's graduation means to me. Check it out if you're so inclined. The money shot: "Haruna’s departure needs to be the start of a short march through the dregs of Morning Musume."



#49 Zoe

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  • こぶしファクトリー

Posted 21 June 2018 - 07:21 PM

Just wait till it gets put up online somewhere. The first half was a mess. They somehow fixed it near the end. Not sure if it was a problem through the broadcast or what. They backtrack was really loud. Morning Coffee took the brunt of it all. I’m sure it will all be fixed when the concert comes out on disc though so it’ll never really be heard how bad it really was.


Just watched some Youtube clips, and I wonder if it's better with a proper (>= 5 channel) sound system. I can't be bothered to download the raw file and check it out though.

I don't mind the stronger back track though cause I like listening to the chorus vocals :lol:

#50 Farrah

Farrah
  • ANGERME

Posted 21 June 2018 - 08:35 PM

I threw a post up at the blog about what Ogata's graduation means to me. Check it out if you're so inclined. The money shot: "Haruna’s departure needs to be the start of a short march through the dregs of Morning Musume."

 

I think we have pretty much the exact same feelings on her, unfortunately (or fortunately? if you're right about her departure being a step toward tossing the scraps that comprise most of this group's lineup at this point).  The current lineup, and Haruna especially, violate the most cardinal rule of being an idol - it is okay to be entirely, 100%, totally and completely musically untalented... as long as you have something else going for you.  It is A-OK to be a shit singer and terrible dancer (especially in Japanese idol groups) as long as you're massively appealing in some other way. 

 

A lot of Momusu's most iconic members were severely lacking in the talent department (Rika, Sayu, JunJun, and as much as I hate to admit it, Koharu) but they had an amazing character and comedic timing going for them.  Those girls seriously went out of their way to set themselves apart and cement their place in idol history despite their shortcomings.  The current lineup is made up mostly by girls who tick of NONE of the quintessential boxes and it's simply become too much.  No one in this group is compensating for their lack of performance ability and it's not okay. 

 

I feel mean for saying it but Haruna simply won't be missed.  I feel about her graduation very much the same as I felt about Aika's - I'm not jumping for joy that you're gone, but I certainly won't be sad to see you go.  It'd almost be an improvement if I WERE jumping for joy over her departure, because it would mean she at least made an impression lol.



#51 Anderei

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  • つんく♂

Posted 22 June 2018 - 12:28 AM

The bland idol is in. I wish I could say it’s just a MM phenomenon but it’s really not. You’ll find them everywhere.

#52 aine

aine
  • 名無しさん‮

Posted 22 June 2018 - 08:01 PM

The interesting idols have moved from Budokan to stuffy pint-sized underground live houses and are stepping all over the mainstream competition and the audience too. Quite literally. (damn I can't find the video I wanted to link here, I'll fix that later)

I couldn't give less fuck about this graduation. I know literally nothing about Ogata because there was nothing to pay attention to or commit to long-term memory. I'm not turning my back at MM but holy shit they've given me nothing to really get excited about in years. I hope a big reset is coming for the whole industry, because otherwise it may as well go ahead and disappear already.

#53 Farrah

Farrah
  • ANGERME

Posted 22 June 2018 - 08:06 PM

Yeah, I know a lot of people complained that the Platinum era was boring or stale... and I know I'm biased because it was probably the peak of my fandom personally as a Kamei fan haha but even if I try to look at it objectively, I feel like it crushes this current era without even trying.  At least back then, even the few boring girls could halfway carry a tune!  If this group had even ONE girl with Kamei's charisma and comedic timing or ONE girl with JunJun's charm, it'd be so much better...



#54 JPope

JPope
  • Dick

Posted 22 June 2018 - 08:22 PM

I'm pretty hard on the Platinum Era still to this day, but there's no question that in terms of talent and personality, they kill the current MM. The things I grew to dislike about the Platinum group are now plaguing the current group, too, only this group doesn't have the talent to fall back on. On the other hand, H!P has more groups I care about this time around, so there's that.



#55 AquaChan

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  • こぶしファクトリー

Posted 22 June 2018 - 08:46 PM

Yeah, I know a lot of people complained that the Platinum era was boring or stale... and I know I'm biased because it was probably the peak of my fandom personally as a Kamei fan haha but even if I try to look at it objectively, I feel like it crushes this current era without even trying.  At least back then, even the few boring girls could halfway carry a tune!  If this group had even ONE girl with Kamei's charisma and comedic timing or ONE girl with JunJun's charm, it'd be so much better...


Totally agree, huge Kamei fan here too.
The one giving hope is Yokoyan. She always seems like she is having the time of her life every single time the camera is on her during concert, and she is daring cute.

But yes, the group has become so bland to me too. Bye Ogata, you will not be missed.

#56 DonJuan

DonJuan
  • ANGERME

Posted 22 June 2018 - 11:15 PM

Yeah... yeah. 

For a long time I tried to excuse the missing performance quality with missing experience. Because hey, looking back at Gaki and Eri we know what a few years can do. But Mizuki and Ikuta will reach Eri's tenure either late this year or early next year (too lazy to calculate atm). They aren't as bad as they were in the beginning, but there was no big improvement as there was with Eri - especially on the character side. Hell, I thought Takahashi was boring, but Mizuki really makes me snooze. Ikuta improved quite a bit in singing but... eh... says more about how bad she was before.

I can't argue with age anymore either - I'd do so if the majority of the group was still 16, but nowadays only the youngest members are that age. Actually, it's only Akane who could fall under the "awkward teenager" trope but she's more entertaining than several older members...

 

I think the quality suffers because Up-Front / Hello! Project decided to take the easy way to entertainment: Having the girls do handshake and photo events while appealing in the "girl next door way" - there's no more "one in a million", there's one of many. It's easier to imagine Morito Chisaki as your girlfriend than Goto Maki. And, of course, strength in numbers: MM is not at its biggest yet again, and I think we'll see another graduation before the next generation debuts, but more girls = more handshake tickets = more sales.



#57 Madara

Madara
  • ANGERME

Posted 24 June 2018 - 10:58 AM

I don't know what you guys are talking about. I love MM today. Mizuki sings really well now and commands the stage and leads the others by setting a tone of harmony and teamwork that provide an anchor for the group. She and Sayumi remain, in my view, the best leaders in the group's history. Erina has always been a solid performer, maybe not cut out for leads, but great in support. She looks great and moves with confidence and dances well. Her voice may not be the best, but she gives it her all. I love her face, too, whether in a burst of joy or its usual unflappability. Ayumi is the best dancer in the group and sings well enough for my tastes. She smiles a lot and puts 110% into performing. Masaki is a good singer, has a lot of spirit and wacky energy and always holds her own. Iikubo brings extraordinary class, grace and timeless beauty to the stage. That's a major contribution, in my book. Sakura is a great singer and carries herself with just enough of a diva air to stand out, but always remains integral to the group. She'd make a good leader. I used to have little hope for 12th Gen, but Miki and Akane have gotten so good in the last year-and-a-half. Miki's dancing and singing have improved greatly and she's really a delight to watch. She smiles a lot, too. She's having a great time. Akane has a quality that's harder to define, but she's definitely bringing more to the stage. She also has a deeper voice, which contrasts nicely with the others. Maria has spirit and energy, although she hasn't quite lived up to her potential yet. Kaga and Reina are both great performers and so is Chiaki. Watching the latter live at Hina Fes was quite a revelation. Put them all together and the group dynamic remains strong. I much prefer this MM to the Platinum era. The only era better, in my view, was 2001-2004, before Nacchi's graduation and then Nono and Aibon's graduation. The downhill slide started after that. 

 

I base all of this from the last few MM concert appearances on disc, including the H!P Countdown Party 2017 and the H!P Winter 2018 concert, as well as seeing them live at Hina Fes this year. I have not seen Haruna Ogata's graduation concert yet.



#58 DonJuan

DonJuan
  • ANGERME

Posted 24 June 2018 - 01:59 PM

That's a totally comprehensible opinion, too. 

 

Personally, I think there's lots of things lacking that'd make their performances more enjoyable for me. I wasn't the biggest fan of Platinum era either, because I thought they were too static, too performance-based, and I was madly missing silly interactions between members and just a bit individuality. Unfortunately that's still missing in the current line-up and I'm blaming their formation dance for this, it just leaves little room for individuality. Their dances aren't that impressive anymore either - just looking at the dance for Are You Happy? makes me cringe. (I guess it would be cool if everybody was completely in sync with the same level of energy, but they simply aren't.) When it comes to concerts I feel they're too shy to make the dance super silly but also not confident to make it really cool. Masaki does this every now and then, she also shows signs of individuality, but she's more than often completely out of it again (can't blame her if her hernia is burning up). When it comes to the missing coolness the lack of Riho's presence is very obvious. It does make the girls look more adorable and awkward, but that's definitely not what I'm looking for. 

 

Singing is... something we can argue about a lot. I think Sakura is really great and Mizuki absolutely decent (and would be even better if they didn't force her to sing half the concert and strain herself), Masaki has her moments, Miki does sometimes, Yokoyan surprisingly has moments in which she sounds great (and butchers 70% of her other lines). Everybody else however is, in my opinion, bad. Watching Oharu's graduation concert was hard

 

Generally I don't mind idols being bad singers. Sayumi was a horrible singer, yet she was, in my opinion, a great idol. Even Koharu was pretty good at what an idol has to do: Being entertaining. Personally I hated her voice and her character, but I understood why she was so sucessful, especially as a solo artist. I do think the current line-up is lacking in being entertaining, outside of performing especially. Can't blame them completely, they don't really get many chances to say something funny or turn around a conversation or anything, maybe in a radio show. Most TV appearances however has them sit down, everybody says a line about their history and their newest single and that's it. 

 

I guess my biggest problem is that I was a huge fan of both the Golden era and the Kaori-led era. It had both great singers and charismatic members and definitely girls that would not become idols nowadays, at least not under one of the bigger agencies.



#59 Anderei

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  • つんく♂

Posted 24 June 2018 - 02:53 PM

This group just takes themselves too seriously for a group that can’t walk the walk. I like plenty of untalented idols, this group just has no spark.

#60 JPope

JPope
  • Dick

Posted 24 June 2018 - 09:24 PM

By my count, the current incarnation of MM sports three girls with actual talent, four or five that might develop into useful pieces, and the rest are either girls who are hopeless or have over-stayed their usefulness. Some of the girls fall into multiple categories, tbh.

 

Sakura is one of the best singers the group has ever had, so no issues there. Maa is solid all-around, and one of the most interesting girls they've had in a decade. Mizuki has become a solid, if uninspiring, singer. I think DJ is right to note that she's massively over-worked, and she would probably be better carrying a smaller load. I disagree with Madara's view of Fuku as a leader, as I would place near the bottom of the list. I will grant that she's leading the least talented group of girls of any previous leader, but that doesn't excuse the fact that Anderei is dead-nuts-on: this group has no spark, and offers little to hold much interest. I think she's a big part of that.

 

Miki and Maria both offer a different set of positives, and both show promise moving forward. Miki as a sort of bi-lingual Yasuda jack-of-all-trades, and Maria as a visual center. Miki has steadily improved in all areas from the beginning, and Maria does enough, well enough, for a pretty girl with some personality. If I was advising the group, I'd actually have her focus more on developing her personality over singing and dancing. Yoko is a wild-card, and if the light switch ever clicks on for her, she could become a powerhouse. I love her attitude and seemingly endless joy for being in the group, which makes her the girl I'm most excited about in MM right now. Kaga is probably all she's ever gonna be, but she's acceptable filler and is so damned likable. 

 

Which brings us to the rest: I'm okay with Ayumi. She's a good dancer, has her moments singing ("How Do You Like Japan?" on last year's tour) and is a veteran presence. Her personality is odd, but at least she has a personality. Still, at 21, what you see is what you're gonna get. I wouldn't lose my shit if she left. Erina and Haruna are straight-up dead weight in my eyes, though. Graduating them would be the classic case of "addition by subtraction" because they are both so bereft of talent, and their continued presence only blocks girls behind them from growing with increased responsibility. Haga is slowly improving, but her ceiling is Asami Kono or maybe a poor-man's Makoto Ogawa. I no longer hate her being in the group, and I'm even slightly intrigued by her potential, but if she graduated next week, that'd be fine, too. Then there's Chisaki, who is 18 and therefore unlikely to improve on her  limited abilities, and seems to hate being in MM. In short, she's everything that Yoko is not. She could be fired tonight, and I'd be totally cool with it.

 

I'd love to see the current leadership completely gutted, Maa made the new leader with Ayumi as her right-hand, and one new honest talent brought on board. Sakura, Maa, and Miki can carry the load vocally, and Yoko's role can be increased appropriately to see if she can eventually be one of the top girls to move the group forward. We scoff at the idea of MM becoming a talented group ever again because the J-idol world has moved away from that so much, but all you have to do is look across the hall at ANGERME to see that it can be done, and how good they can be. Sure, ANGERME sells half of what MM sells, but that's the difference in branding. If the current lineup of ANGERME was called Morning Musume, they'd sell better than they do.