Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by al kusanagi »

No it isn't. Here is the job, here are the stipulations. Don't like it, don't do it.
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by Pflaume »

Yeah, sorry, those are whack comparisons. A twenty year old girl dating is not the same as a teacher sleeping with a student or an athlete cheating. The hell?



I totally don't get this stance of, "Oh boy, the idol industry sure is shitty, let's just kick back and watch since it's just gonna keep shittin' along anyhow!" If fans change their stance, companies change along with them. They won't have a choice.



Something shitty being typical doesn't mean you just need to be okay with it. We're not talking about 3 day benders that culminate in idol girls snorting cocaine off of a sacrificial goat's ass. We are talking about a twenty year old woman having a boyfriend.



Edit: Also do not even get me started on how this girl is getting called a slut (or in your case "ho") for having a relationship. Not okay.
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by aine »

[quote name='Al Kusanagi' timestamp='1359725487' post='143231']

No it isn't. Here is the job, here are the stipulations. Don't like it, don't do it.

[/quote]
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by al kusanagi »

I don't give a shit about "being a woman" or social expectations or whatever. Here is a job. Here is a rule that applies to the job. Don't piss in the frier at McDonalds. Oh, you pissed in it? You're fired. It's as simple as that. Unless they are made to sign those contracts at gunpoint and not able to leave, they they took it upon themselves to agree to those terms. Period.
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by Pflaume »

What you seem to be missing is that even if you're not a teacher, an adult sleeping with a student is still statutory rape. That even if you're not an employee of McDonald's, pissing in a frier would still land you in jail. That steroids are often obtained illegally and that you'd be in deep shit for doing them without proper medical reason anyhow. This is why those comparisons are bullshit.



You are literally comparing a grown-ass woman having a boyfriend to someone contaminating food and endangering people or committing statutory rape. If you don't see how that's backasswards I can't even help you.
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by al kusanagi »

Okay, fine. My contract says that I cannot express anything negative about the organization I work for in a public venue. It's right there, clearly written in the contract. So lets say I got really pissed off and ranted about my job on Facebook. I is an AMERICAN!!! I haz teh freedom of speech!!!! Y U fire me?!? No, I can't say shit if they fire me, because it is right there on that piece of paper I read over and signed when I agreed to the job.
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by Melon »

FOR FUCK'S SAKE AL all those comparisons are shit because IT IS NOT THE SAME.



You are using CRIMINAL AND ILLEGAL things as comparison to a fucking relationship and this slut shaming shit FUCK I can't even process this shit anymore. Fuck this.



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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by MiniLovely »

I want to cry. Minami. <img src='http://mm-bbs.org/public/style_emoticon ... pyeyes.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':puppyeyes:' />

What the fuck is wrong with AKB48?

If management forced her to do it, disgusting.

If she chose to do it herself, disgusting still!!

Either way, she's totally fucking brainwashed by idol culture to feel this guilty to shave her head like this. I know everyone else in the thread has beaten it to death but this is an act of humiliation and is NOT OK.



I want to buy the girl some really cute hats.



I'd fault Minami so hard if I didn't know she'd been in the industry since she was a derpderp formative child and has been effing brainwashed by this sick culture. She's a very small piece of a larger puzzle and is a victim of the system.



I want to see her rocking some cute hats and wigs, now. It's a SHAME this happened to her.
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by al kusanagi »

Whatever. Should the rule be changed? You can argue for that point all day long. But I am saying "Here is the contract/rule AS IT STANDS TODAY." They broke it. They knowingly entered into the agreement, knowingly did the activity that caused the problem, and should face the repercussions. I think the whole situation with the head shaving and demotion is fucked up, but I'm just here arguing the point of this is something they willingly entered into and they should deal with it. Changing the industry is a whole other argument.



PS. By the way, this is just more bullshit shocking AKB marketing anyway, and I'm sure she's being compensated as fuck for it, so I don't know why people are getting so damn upset.
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by Melon »

As knowingly as a 13 year old can, sure.
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by al kusanagi »

I'm fairly sure the parents have to be involved in the contract process if they are underaged.
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by al kusanagi »

And if you want love as an idol, then just do what Sayu did and go gay. Or be like Reina and bang your brother.
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by Pflaume »

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Let me repeat myself: This is not a reasonable work condition. This is not a reasonable work condition. This is not a reasonable work condition.



It needs to change.



This "the parents were there to sign the contract" crap is one of the dumbest arguments in idol fandom. I don't see how having a parent make the decision for the child makes this less sad. Shit, that makes it MORE sad. Now the poor girls are stuck in this contract and it wasn't even really their decision. To boot, they were thrown into this situation by the people who are supposed to protect them. Yeah, great, that really soothes my anger. <img src='http://mm-bbs.org/public/style_emoticon ... popper.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':popper:' />
Last edited by Pflaume on Fri Feb 01, 2013 6:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by yuzuriha »

The point is this SHOULD NOT be a rule. Especially if they are over freaking 16 years old. That is a perfectly normal age to start having boyfriends. Idols are normal girls with normal feelings, and are actually kind of promoted as such. These girls have to sing about love and heartbreak and relationships without being allowed to experience it herself. That is the number one thing that has ALWAYS bothered me about idols. How can they put their REAL emotion into these songs if they have no clue? IF they aren't allowed to date then let them sing about puppies and shopping and how much studying for entrance exams suck. These girls have female fans too, and shouldn't be pandering to ONLY the CRAZY DELUSIONAL FANATIC male ones. I know personally (using this as an example because I'm not an AKB fan), if I found out Risako had a boyfriend I would be ECSTATIC for her. SAME AS I WOULD BE FOR YAMA PI IF I FOUND OUT HE HAD A GIRLFRIEND. I want these idols I look up to to be able to live happy lives.
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by aine »

Have you people ever work real jobs before? Here's a quote from a random +"employee handbook" +"fraternization policy" search result. I'd have directly quoted my own Employee Handbook which says virtually the same, but I prefer to keep my ass safe.


To avoid the dangers of management fraternization with a subordinate employee, and to help prevent

even the appearance of improper conduct, favoritism, improper use of authority or sexual harassment, it

is the policy of Fleet Staff that managers, supervisors or any other employee who has the authority to

directly or indirectly affect the terms and conditions of another‟s employment shall not fraternize with that

employee, nor shall any employee maintain such a relationship with any employee of a Fleet Staff client.

The fraternization prohibited in this policy includes dating, romantic involvement or sexual relations and

does not include and is not meant to discourage friendship or social activities among Fleet Staff

employees or client employees. Should a personal relationship prohibited by this policy be contemplated,

the supervisor, manager or employee involved is required to notify their manager immediately, as well as

notify the human resource department. Where a relationship prohibited by this policy exists, Fleet Staff

shall take whatever action it believes necessary to remove the parties from any continued contact and/or

supervisory line of authority. If possible without compromising Fleet Staff business interests and at Fleet

Staff‟s discretion, Fleet Staff may consider the affected parties‟ opinions on how best to resolve the

situation (i.e. resignation, relocation, etc.) prior to making a decision.
Once again, you sign it, you're legally bound by it. Just like you are by all the EULAs you tick to have read and accepted when installing software. My or your personal opinion about the morality of such rules has nothing to do with their legal validity.
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by Pflaume »

They aren't forbidding dating a co-worker, boss or subordinate. They are forbidding dating ANYONE AT ALL.



[quote name='yuzuriha' timestamp='1359730272' post='143249']

The point is this SHOULD NOT be a rule.

[/quote]



Thank you.
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by Ap2000 »

[quote name='Petit Hulk' timestamp='1359727525' post='143238']

FOR FUCK'S SAKE AL all those comparisons are shit because IT IS NOT THE SAME.



You are using CRIMINAL AND ILLEGAL things as comparison to a fucking relationship and this slut shaming shit FUCK I can't even process this shit anymore. Fuck this.



Men of the BBS, you disappoint me.

[/quote]



This is exactly what I meant.

Except for the last sentence, of course... lol

Those examples by Al included harming yourself/cheating, putting a whole plane in danger and potentially abusing your position. No such thing is even remotely comparable to dating a person.



The point is also, that you don't get your head shaven and humiliated in the internet/TV for this. Whether being pushed into that situation or her management "just" allowing it doesn't matter at all, it's always despicable by them.
Last edited by Ap2000 on Fri Feb 01, 2013 7:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by Pflaume »

[quote name='Ap2000' timestamp='1359731892' post='143257']

This is exactly what I meant.

Except for the last sentence, of course... lol

Those examples by Al included harming yourself/cheating, putting a whole plane in danger and potentially abusing your position. No such thing is even remotely comparable to dating a person.



The point is also, that you don't get your head shaven and humiliated in the internet/TV for this. Whether being pushed into that situation or her management "just" allowing it doesn't matter at all, it's always despicable by them.

[/quote]



You know some shit's gone down when Ap and I come down on the same side of a sexism debate.
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by Anderei »

I don't even see how they would be considered co-workers to start with.



Also, she's one of the original members who joined in 2005, which would have made her only 13. 13 year olds aren't really thinking too far ahead when they sign up to be idols. How the hell would she have known she'd still be around as an adult at 20 who can't even spend time with a guy in private? She's spent all of her teens seeing other members leave because of this, and it's fucked her up to the point where she thinks she needs to shave her head to earn the forgiveness one small disgusting subset (because casual fans don't care, girls don't care, and I bet there's even some male wota out there who worship her and still don't care) who think this rule is okay and should be upheld. There have been people asking about this situation outside the AKB theater and general consensus is that it's fucked up.
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by tsukinobyouin »

I don't normally come into this thread because I know nothing about AKB, but I saw something about a girl shaving her head on Facebook and came to figure out what the hell happened. I still don't get why head shaving was necessary instead of the usual hiatus, graduation, or just profusely apologizing and promising not to do it again that seems to happen with every other agency. <img src='http://mm-bbs.org/public/style_emoticon ... nfused.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':confused:' />



I don't want to get caught up in taking a side on the whole debate, I just want to add:



While there are LOTS of double standards in the industry, these particular rules aren't limited to women. Male idols aren't allowed to date either. Everyone thinks Johnny's is more relaxed about it, but that's not really true. Yes, there are a few of them who are married or openly admit to dating a specific person, but they're all in their late 30s or early 40s. Kimura Takuya was probably the youngest to get married (still at 28) but he's so absurdly popular no scandal can really touch him. There was a Junior a few years back who was discovered to have a secret wife and he got kicked out immediately. It really all comes down to popularity for both genders. Nacchi's career wasn't ruined by her playstation boyfriend thing because people loved Nacchi. Some Johnny's get their scandals swept under the rug too, but if there are "really scandalous" photographs and the person is young or not so popular, they get pulled from dramas, put on time out, kicked out, or forced to do the sad apology too.



I'm not saying any of this is okay or not okay, I just wanted to point out that this isn't entirely a women's issue, it's more of a complicated industry-as-a-whole issue.
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by Pflaume »

TnB, I actually wholeheartedly agree! The dating ban shouldn't exist for men, either, and yet it does.



What bothers me on the "sexism" front is more that the women get attacked as being sluts, or often get the brunt of the anger. It's always this response of, "Dumb bitch should've thought of that before she spread her legs lolololol." This is an issue in Korea, too. Take the IU thing, for example. Or even look at how the male half of this scandal's agency went about it by comparison.



But the dating ban being bullshit applies to both genders, you're correct.
Last edited by Pflaume on Fri Feb 01, 2013 7:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by Miss Moonlight »

There's no question the system is fucked up, and a culture in which a system like that is considered totally normal is pretty fucked up too.



BUT, despite that, these girls are desperate to become idols, and thrilled when it happens for them, with full awareness of what that entails. Maybe THAT'S fucked up too, but you can't just flip a switch one day and change a whole culture. Even if you argue that a 12 or 13-year-old who enters into the idol world is not fully aware of the implications of their choice despite their overwhelming excitement at the time, Minegishi is a grown-ass woman and she was so desperate to STAY in the idol world that she shaved her damn head. So some part of her work makes her so happy that she went to this length to keep doing it. There have been countless idols before her who were faced with the same choice, and the ones who didn't want to stay said "fuck it, I'm leaving."



I DO wish that more of the latter would publicly stand up for themselves rather than leaving quietly. Maybe then things would slowly change.



EDIT: Of course like 4 more people posted while I was writing this.



[quote name='Plum' timestamp='1359733394' post='143268']

What bothers me on the "sexism" front is more that the women get attacked as being sluts, or often get the brunt of the anger. It's always this response of, "Dumb bitch should've thought of that before she spread her legs lolololol."

[/quote]

Yeah, that mentality is pretty disgusting.
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by Anderei »

I think it's more that the popular girls are given the chance to stay and redeem themselves. Everyone lately who has had a scandal like this and immediately left have been girls who were lower ranked.



He doesn't have a dating ban, because his agency treats people like human beings and what not, so it is her fault alone, but she's still obviously the product of a messed up system.
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by Ap2000 »

[quote name='Plum' timestamp='1359732381' post='143259']

[quote name='Ap2000' timestamp='1359731892' post='143257']

This is exactly what I meant.

Except for the last sentence, of course... lol

Those examples by Al included harming yourself/cheating, putting a whole plane in danger and potentially abusing your position. No such thing is even remotely comparable to dating a person.



The point is also, that you don't get your head shaven and humiliated in the internet/TV for this. Whether being pushed into that situation or her management "just" allowing it doesn't matter at all, it's always despicable by them.

[/quote]



You know some shit's gone down when Ap and I come down on the same side of a sexism debate.

[/quote]



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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by Pflaume »

It's not my fault Arnold makes me feel like a man.



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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by tsukinobyouin »

[quote name='Plum' timestamp='1359733394' post='143268']

What bothers me on the "sexism" front is more that the women get attacked as being sluts, or often get the brunt of the anger. It's always this response of, "Dumb bitch should've thought of that before she spread her legs lolololol." This is an issue in Korea, too. Take the IU thing, for example. Or even look at how the male half of this scandal's agency went about it by comparison.

[/quote]



This borders on me getting more into it than I had planned, but <img src='http://mm-bbs.org/public/style_emoticon ... /laugh.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':lol:' /> Yes, I agree. I think it's okay to say "she broke the rules and she should have known better/handled it differently" (see: Miss Moonlight's post) but slut shaming is a terrible and disgusting thing and takes it to a different level.



I do think slut shaming exists just as bad outside of Asia. We don't have the idol rules in the USA, but plenty of people (of both genders) are just as fast to call a girl a slut if she *gasp* talks about enjoying sex or *gasp* has multiple partners. <img src='http://mm-bbs.org/public/style_emoticon ... lleyes.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':rolleyes:' />



As others have pointed out, the average Japanese person doesn't care about this stuff or loves to gossip about it just like Americans do. Lots of Japanese people acknowledge and openly talk about agencies owning their talents like birds in a cage, corruption, and so on. I wouldn't say this is "Japanese culture's" problem, it's just another example of the entertainment industry being a tough world to live in. That's true for one reason or another all over the world.
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by Shoujo Q »

My pretty 48 thread, what did you do!? <img src='http://mm-bbs.org/public/style_emoticon ... pyeyes.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':puppyeyes:' />



A mod for this section needs to purge the scandal of Minami into its own thread. Poor duck lips doesn't even have a moment of graduation peace in between it all.
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by Ap2000 »

[quote name='TnB' timestamp='1359735498' post='143281']

[quote name='Plum' timestamp='1359733394' post='143268']

What bothers me on the "sexism" front is more that the women get attacked as being sluts, or often get the brunt of the anger. It's always this response of, "Dumb bitch should've thought of that before she spread her legs lolololol." This is an issue in Korea, too. Take the IU thing, for example. Or even look at how the male half of this scandal's agency went about it by comparison.

[/quote]



This borders on me getting more into it than I had planned, but <img src='http://mm-bbs.org/public/style_emoticon ... /laugh.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':lol:' /> Yes, I agree. I think it's okay to say "she broke the rules and she should have known better/handled it differently" (see: Miss Moonlight's post) but slut shaming is a terrible and disgusting thing and takes it to a different level.



I do think slut shaming exists just as bad outside of Asia. We don't have the idol rules in the USA, but plenty of people (of both genders) are just as fast to call a girl a slut if she *gasp* talks about enjoying sex or *gasp* has multiple partners. <img src='http://mm-bbs.org/public/style_emoticon ... lleyes.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':rolleyes:' />

[/quote]



On the other hand, men that don't fuck each weekend are often considered betas.
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by tsukinobyouin »

[quote name='Shoujo Q' timestamp='1359740162' post='143294']

My pretty 48 thread, what did you do!? <img src='http://mm-bbs.org/public/style_emoticon ... pyeyes.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':puppyeyes:' />



A mod for this section needs to purge the scandal of Minami into its own thread. Poor duck lips doesn't even have a moment of graduation peace in between it all.

[/quote]



Oh, that's me! Sorry, working on that now. I've never actually had to do this before so sorry in advance if I fuck it up. <img src='http://mm-bbs.org/public/style_emoticon ... /laugh.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':lol:' /> Thread temporarily locked while I fix it. BRB Y'all.



EDIT: It's done (obviously).



[quote name='Ap2000' timestamp='1359740811' post='143295']

[quote name='TnB' timestamp='1359735498' post='143281']

[quote name='Plum' timestamp='1359733394' post='143268']

What bothers me on the "sexism" front is more that the women get attacked as being sluts, or often get the brunt of the anger. It's always this response of, "Dumb bitch should've thought of that before she spread her legs lolololol." This is an issue in Korea, too. Take the IU thing, for example. Or even look at how the male half of this scandal's agency went about it by comparison.

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This borders on me getting more into it than I had planned, but <img src='http://mm-bbs.org/public/style_emoticon ... /laugh.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':lol:' /> Yes, I agree. I think it's okay to say "she broke the rules and she should have known better/handled it differently" (see: Miss Moonlight's post) but slut shaming is a terrible and disgusting thing and takes it to a different level.



I do think slut shaming exists just as bad outside of Asia. We don't have the idol rules in the USA, but plenty of people (of both genders) are just as fast to call a girl a slut if she *gasp* talks about enjoying sex or *gasp* has multiple partners. <img src='http://mm-bbs.org/public/style_emoticon ... lleyes.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':rolleyes:' />

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On the other hand, men that don't fuck each weekend are often considered betas.

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Which is also unfair and stupid.
Last edited by tsukinobyouin on Fri Feb 01, 2013 10:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Minegishi Minami has boyfriend, shaves head

Post by AEUGNewtype »

This is getting pretty awesome. I might reply to more specific things later, but for now, I'll at least say that management confirmed that this was entirely her idea. The video and the hair thing. They said she agreed to come record this video and when she got there to do it, her head was already shaved. You can tell the shave was done pretty haphazardly, and it would make sense this way. Of course, this is the idol world, so about 40%-50% of what we hear is utter bullshit, but that's what this game's all about, isn't it? Sorting through the lies and bullshit?



EDIT: I'll also post a re-phrasing of what I posted on Petit's FB earlier today..



I agree it is disturbing that someone would feel the need to shame themselves over something that is normal human behavior, its hard to say where this line really lies. You have the one side where she has to know that the behavior is against the rules of what she has signed a contract to and has a responsibility to uphold, as shitty and morally effed up as it might be. I guess think of like a religious priest, they make a vow not to have relationships, yet they get involved in sexual encounters pretty often and suffer consequences for it (sometimes..) and there is quite a bit of public shaming and self-harm/suicide involved with that whole sub-society as well. Ironically enough, that entire culture is also supposed to be known for "purity" and "innocence" as well, its just disguised as reverence and divinity instead of youth and happiness.



I'd like to think that some time in the next generation or so, the newer generation of Japanese men who are more compassionate and respectful towards women in general will come to be (or so it seems, at least, outside of the otaku and businessmen who were thrown into these traditional values from the day they were born.) I don't want to try to get into deep discussion of why social change may just happen with time as the older, more antiquated ways of thinking die with the people who support them. Sounds kinda morbid, but it seems to be bubbling under the surface to some extent, but who knows how far it'll go or if it'll just dissipate and continue the way it is now.



I constantly hear stories of the population of women in Japan turning to Johnny's and other male idols to fill what they feel is a void in their lives regarding relationships and having a fantasy relationship with the idols to avoid being in real relationships with Japanese men, and that's probably at least a small part of why the birth rate is so low.



Japan needs to really be asking themselves as a nation why things are as bad as they are when it comes to things like this (as well as economy, finance, and a few other areas of well-being that they aren't doing so hot at,) but obviously self-examination is about as far from a strong trait as it can be for them.
Last edited by AEUGNewtype on Fri Feb 01, 2013 12:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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